Glossary entry

Dutch term or phrase:

permanentienummer

English translation:

on-call number

    The asker opted for community grading. The question was closed on 2016-08-07 08:54:07 based on peer agreement (or, if there were too few peer comments, asker preference.)
Aug 3, 2016 15:57
7 yrs ago
10 viewers *
Dutch term

permanentienummer

Dutch to English Bus/Financial General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters
Two telephone numbers for a company are shown. One is simply the number and the other is followed by the reference "permanentienummer". From what I've been able to figure out, it is a number that can always be reached. TIA for your help.
Change log

Aug 3, 2016 16:26: writeaway changed "Field" from "Other" to "Bus/Financial" , "Field (write-in)" from "Flemish-English" to "(none)"

Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:

Non-PRO (1): writeaway

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Discussion

Michael Beijer Aug 3, 2016:
@writeaway: re your statement, "yes, adding emergency for no reason is dead wrong. this is really everyday language, at least in Belgium. no need for mountain/molehill time."

Sorry, but you are even deader wrong. We were not told what kind of company this is, and so "emergency" could very well be applicable. After all, there are two numbers: one to call for normal stuff, during normal hours, and the other for, well, special stuff, most likely outside of working hours. It doesn't take a genius to think of a few examples of companies/organisations where "emergency" might be added: dental, private security, property, medical, travel, travel insurance, universities, sports, care, roadside assistance, etc. etc. etc.
Michael Beijer Aug 3, 2016:
(interpretation #2) e.g.: the following ref is about lawyers being available on standby, rather than being available 24/7:

"Lawyers for everyone

For people with low incomes, the law provides a legal aid service (aide juridique/juridische bijstand, formerly known as ‘pro deo’) and court costs assistance (assistance judiciaire/rechtsbijstand).

Through legal aid, the services of a lawyer are made available completely or partially free of charge. It is a two-tier system:

• Front-line legal aid (aide juridique de première ligne/eerstelijnsbijstand) is available to all, and is not linked to income. Lawyers are available on standby (permanence/permanentie) for brief consultations: initial advice, a request for information, etc.
The bodies responsible for the provision of front-line legal aid are known as ‘legal aid commissions’ (Commissions d’Aide Juridique/Commissies voor Juridische Bijstand).
• Second-line legal aid
[…]"

(https://e-justice.europa.eu/content_legal_professions-29-be-... )
Michael Beijer Aug 3, 2016:
I think that there might potentially be two different ways to interpret this, depending on the type of company in Buck's src text.

1. It is simply a number that is reachable 24/7
2. It refers to staff who are on call/on standby (e.g. out of hours)(e.g. to provide special/emergency services)
philgoddard Aug 3, 2016:
I think Michael is on the right lines. 24/7 implies you could phone them at 10 am, but I get the impression it means out of hours.
Michael Beijer Aug 3, 2016:
@Buck: What kind of company is it? Business, medical, emergency, maintenance, etc. context?
Alexander Schleber (X) Aug 3, 2016:
continuously reachable number A telephone number on which you can always reach someone.
Michael Beijer Aug 3, 2016:
maybe sth like "emergency stand-by number"?

or sth with "on-call"

another option: "24/7 emergency telephone number"

Proposed translations

+5
40 mins
Selected

on-call number

Preferred term in a Belgium translation. Can't supply client name for confidentiality reasons. In any case, it certainly fits the bill.
Peer comment(s):

agree Kitty Brussaard : Indeed, this would be another option, as already mentioned in my own answer :-)
14 mins
agree Michael Beijer : jazeker, meneer de apotheker
21 mins
agree writeaway : yes, adding emergency for no reason is dead wrong. this is really everyday language, at least in Belgium. no need for mountain/molehill time.
1 hr
agree Tina Vonhof (X) : This would fit the bill, yes.
21 hrs
neutral Barend van Zadelhoff : Kitty gave this option already in her answer and since the specific context is not mentioned...
1 day 1 hr
agree Richard Purdom
1 day 23 hrs
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thanks. This fits the bill!"
+3
14 mins

24/7 customer service number; 24/7 support number

It all depends on the context really. For instance, if this is about out-of-hours medical services, it would probably be called on-call number.
Peer comment(s):

agree Michael Beijer : Could be correct. However, as you said, context might dictate otherwise.
11 mins
Thanks! And indeed, these are just a few possible options which may not fit asker's actual context. I decided to post them as an answer with Barend's advice in mind not to clutter the D-box with provisional answers. It's a riskier business though :-)
agree writeaway : Is bounced off the French (permanence). Is everyday language and is definitely correct.
12 mins
Thanks!
agree Barend van Zadelhoff : Mede namens Brian (Quigley). :-)
4 hrs
Much appreciated :-)
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+2
23 mins

constantly manned ('staffed') helpline number

compare - on a Belgian French association - une permanence téléphonique.

Otherwise, in an emergency, call legendary Canadian rapper Drake 'on his cell phone'.
Example sentence:

This is accessed via a separate telephone number which is constantly-manned by our out-of-hours telephone support team.

Peer comment(s):

agree Michael Beijer : see my comment at Kitty's answer.
2 mins
Thanks. Glad you 'liked' the cell phone joke.
agree Kitty Brussaard : My agree for the joke at the very least and because I've seen far 'worse' answers being agreed with during my years on KudoZ :-) PS. Corporate lingo would probably be '24/7' rather than 'constantly manned/staffed'.
49 mins
Danke je wel! Agreed. A UK law (solicitors) firm vs. corporate would rarely use 24/7 www.freemanssolicitors.net/site/contact/emergencies/
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+2
59 mins

(emergency) stand-by number

What the hell, this makes 4.

Leave in or out "emergency", depending on the type of company.
Peer comment(s):

agree Kitty Brussaard : And indeed, one more good option for the list :-)
9 mins
Thanks!
agree Alexander Schleber (X) : This is the one I like best. Ze hebben bijvoorbeeld een "permanentie" van de pompiers en de politie.
11 mins
Thanks!
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+1
14 hrs

answering service

Includes the meanings provided in other answers (regarding constant availability); avoids special meanings not implied in source (such as 'emergency'); appears in search results as (most) common usage (see URL below); is immediately understood by native speakers as a number that will be answered at any time (albeit perhaps not directly by the party one is trying to contact, but by a 'service' which facilitates such contact). A possible definition is: 'A (third party) telephone service enabling transmission of messages, at all times, to someone not otherwise contactable via a normal private or business telephone number.'
Example sentence:

If unable to contact us on these numbers please phone our answering service.

Peer comment(s):

agree Michael Beijer : seems to be another option / synonyms: "telefoonpermanentie", "telefonische permanentie"
1 hr
Thanks Michael. And yes, reading 'permanentie' as 'shift', the source term would literally imply a 'permanent or 24/7 phone shift'.
neutral Kitty Brussaard : This seems to be the term used by the third parties offering these type of services ... I don't think it would be referred to as such alongside the main/regular phone number on a company's website. / See http://tinyurl.com/z74j7j9
8 hrs
It is used. In fact, the only term that escapes the need for 24/7 to convey that it is 'always answered' - even when the other phones are not. See also Oxford Online - and especialiy the examples they give.
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Reference comments

6 mins
Reference:

refs

see:

http://www.proz.com/kudoz/flemish_to_english/human_resources...

http://www.proz.com/kudoz/french_to_dutch/marketing/190956-u...

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Note added at 9 mins (2016-08-03 16:07:16 GMT)
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60. Het Hof heeft deze lijn voortgezet in het arrest Pfeiffer e.a.( 47 ) In geding waren aldaar de perioden van dienstwaarneming/permanentie die ambulancehulpverleners verrichten in het kader van een dienst voor medische spoedhulp, die tussen de spoedinterventies meer of minder lange perioden omvat waarin geen werkzaamheden worden verricht.
=
60. That approach was followed in Pfeiffer and Others , ( 47 ) which concerned time spent in attendance by emergency workers in the framework of emergency activities comprising periods of inactivity of varying lengths between emergency assistance.

(CELEX Documents of the European Court of Justice pt3.tmx)

"Diagonale" samenwerking tussen, enerzijds, die centrale verbindingsbureaus en de verbindingsdiensten en, anderzijds, de autoriteiten die bevoegd zijn voor de toepassing van Verordening (EG) nr. 515/97 is evenwel niet mogelijk wegens organisatorische redenen, bevoegdheidsredenen of specifieke nationale operationele redenen, en vanwege het communicatienetwerk en het ontbreken van een permanentie ('s nachts en in de weekends).
=
But horizontal cooperation between these central liaison offices and liaison departments and the authorities responsible for applying Regulation (EC) No 515/97 is not possible for organisational reasons or because of the material or operational powers conferred in each Member State and for reasons related to the communications network and the absence of stand-by officers (nights and weekends).

(CELEX Customs Union and free movement of goods.tmx)

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Note added at 19 mins (2016-08-03 16:17:06 GMT)
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"permanentie / dienst

In België wordt vaak de uitdrukking permanentie hebben gebruikt in de betekenis 'dienst hebben', ook door standaardtaalsprekers. Toch is er een vrij grote groep taalgebruikers die dat gebruik afkeurt. Daarom is het niet duidelijk of permanentie hebben tot de standaardtaal in België gerekend kan worden. Standaardtaal in het hele taalgebied is in elk geval dienst hebben.

• Welke apotheker heeft er dienst / avonddienst / nachtdienst / weekenddienst?

Ook de combinatie dienstdoende arts, apotheker, verpleger en de combinatie arts, apotheker, verpleger met weekenddienst, avonddienst, nachtdienst zijn standaardtaal in het hele taalgebied.

Standaardtaal in België zijn de uitdrukkingen wachtdienst hebben en van wacht zijn.

Mijn huisarts heeft dit weekend wachtdienst.
Mijn huisarts is dit weekend van wacht.
Wie is de apotheker van wacht?"

(http://www.taaltelefoon.be/permanentie-dienst )

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Note added at 21 mins (2016-08-03 16:19:05 GMT)
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JurLex:
wachtdienst = standby duty

Van Dale:
wachtdienst de (m.) =
guard duty
marine watch, guard mount, sentry-go
 
(in België) wachtdienst hebben = be on call

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Note added at 22 mins (2016-08-03 16:19:47 GMT)
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permanentie (de ~ (v.), ~s)
voortdurende aanwezigheid, doorlopend verzekerde dienst, permanent toezicht

standaardtaal in België? status onduidelijk

Fr. permanence

De permanentie verzekeren.
Ik heb permanentie vanavond.
Tijdens permanenties is de Jeugddienst on line bereikbaar via MSN.

“De agent die de bewuste avond permanentie had, kon zich niets meer herinneren van de diamantroof. (in België, status onduidelijk)” Taaladvies.net

(http://www.vlaamswoordenboek.be/definities/term/permanentie )

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Note added at 16 hrs (2016-08-04 08:04:01 GMT)
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DUTCH SYNONYMS:

telefoonpermanentie
telefonische permanentie
Peer comments on this reference comment:

agree Kitty Brussaard : I remember the term 'permanentie' also being discussed quite extensively in the context of yet another KudoZ question (posted by yourself, in fact) / :-) http://www.proz.com/kudoz/dutch_to_english/business_commerce...
29 mins
thanks! / ha! I knew I was forgetting sth. thanks for reminding me
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