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When honesty probably doesn't pay...
Thread poster: Tina Colquhoun
Giles Watson
Giles Watson  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 09:38
Italian to English
In memoriam
Meanwhile, in real life... Jan 30, 2009

Jeff Whittaker wrote:

What these companies that compete for jobs solely based on price don't seem to realize is that we can also "maintain" or even "improve" our rates by working with clients directly and avoiding them altogether.



Way to go, Jeff.



If there really was a "crisis" and things were really so drastic to the point where we absolutely HAD to lower rates, wouldn't it make more sense for us to work for direct clients at the reduced rate of .10 - .15 a word, rather than take jobs from these companies at .03 - .06 a word??



Well, there really is a crisis and it is forcing clients to the extremes of the price/quality spectrum. To maintain revenue, they either have to cut their prices and quality while increasing volume or accept lower volume and crank up the price, which means they have to offer top quality and - crucially - can be persuaded to pay for it.

It's the ones in the middle - mid price, quality, volume, etc - that tend to be the first to go to the wall. Look at Woolworths in the UK, undercut by hard discount outlets and, by the company's own choice, never in the running against top-end retail chains.

If you can offer the quality, you should be able to raise your rates in a crisis because you will have too much work.

Giles


 
Can Altinbay
Can Altinbay  Identity Verified
Local time: 03:38
Japanese to English
+ ...
In memoriam
Nope, not opportunity Jan 30, 2009

Sara Senft wrote:

I heard that the most similar Japanese translation for "crisis" is "opportunity."

Are there any Japanese translators reading this that can clarify? I only know a few random words of Japanese.



The second character, 機, has more of the sense of state or occasion. Combined with the character for danger (危), you get crisis (kiki). Opportunity is 機会 (kikai). I suspect it's the same with Chinese.

This sort of thing happens when people translate words or characters rather than meaning. When I was a kid, Ripley's Believe it or Not has an item that proclaimed that in Russian (remember, those were Communist times), "Believe it or Not" is called "Believe it or Else". It's easy to see what happened. "Else" may even have been at the very beginning of the dictionary entry for "not".

I've seen this crisis = opportunity many times. it's probably spread faster because it's the kind of thing rah-rah sales rallies enjoy to "motivate" the "team". Is there already a book covering this? Some word derivation books cover mistranslations, but I haven't seen one dedicated to this.

Of course, for a much more disastrous collection, see engrish.com.


 
Samuel Murray
Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 09:38
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
Please enlighten me Jan 30, 2009

Tina Colquhoun wrote:
This afternoon I received an invitation (from an agency I seldom work with) to answer a 'financial crisis' survey. ... I think I can guess where they're heading with this one...


There seems to be a lot of rolling eyes in the responses, but try as I might, I can't figure out what is supposed to be so bad about this survey. Obviously the agency is hearing rumours and they want confirmation at grass roots level.

So what if you tell them that business has been slow? That doesn't mean your rates are more negotiable (it actually means the opposite, wouldn't you say).

Ultimately you're in charge of how much you charge. So be honest (if you want to be).


 
Sara Mullin
Sara Mullin  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 09:38
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
My own survey Jan 30, 2009

I also got this email and my gut feeling is that it's an attempt to weed out the translators who won't accept lower rates from their database... but who knows, I could very well be wrong. It indeed could be a genuine concern for how the translators are feeling about work these days...

In any case, I answered their two questions honestly almost 24 hours ago and I haven't heard back from them with the results (promised within 24 hours)...

So, my (joking) survey for all of
... See more
I also got this email and my gut feeling is that it's an attempt to weed out the translators who won't accept lower rates from their database... but who knows, I could very well be wrong. It indeed could be a genuine concern for how the translators are feeling about work these days...

In any case, I answered their two questions honestly almost 24 hours ago and I haven't heard back from them with the results (promised within 24 hours)...

So, my (joking) survey for all of you who answered their survey is:

(1) did you answer that you have had to lower your rates in the last six months

and

(2) if the answer to number 1 is yes, have you heard back from this company?

Note at 20:25: A few hours later... I admit it, I was wrong. This company seems to be genuinely interested in the translator!

[Edited at 2009-01-30 19:26 GMT]
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Vito Smolej
Vito Smolej
Germany
Local time: 09:38
Member (2004)
English to Slovenian
+ ...
SITE LOCALIZER
I take them seriously Jan 30, 2009

... so I answered truthfully - whatever my actual answer was. After all, it's all a question of trust and integrity.

btw, the one agency I am talking about, has a perfect score, both on BB and in my own experience.

Vito

[Edited at 2009-01-30 15:35 GMT]


 
Amy Duncan (X)
Amy Duncan (X)  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 05:38
Portuguese to English
+ ...
It's better not to jump to conclusions... Jan 30, 2009

I replied to this survey, and here is the answer I received today:

Dear Colleague,

We had an amazing response to our survey - well over 1000 of you responded, and we had almost 400 written responses as well. So thanks for your participation, and as promised here are the results:
What has happened to your volume of work over the past 6 months?

* Gone up - 22%
* Stayed the same - 40%
* Gone down - 38%

Although quite
... See more
I replied to this survey, and here is the answer I received today:

Dear Colleague,

We had an amazing response to our survey - well over 1000 of you responded, and we had almost 400 written responses as well. So thanks for your participation, and as promised here are the results:
What has happened to your volume of work over the past 6 months?

* Gone up - 22%
* Stayed the same - 40%
* Gone down - 38%

Although quite a few of you said that you were busier than ever, a much larger number mentioned a decrease in work - a lot of people mentioned that January had been particularly slow. From an agency perspective, that has been our experience as well.

What has happened to the rates you are able to charge over the past 6 months?

* Gone up - 12%
* Stayed the same - 72%
* Gone down - 16%

A lot of people mentioned that agencies have been imposing reductions in their rates, and a frequent comment was that agencies are "taking advantage" of the recession to reduce rates. Many of you also mentioned slow payments from agencies and agencies extending their payment terms.

A lot of people have been affected by currency movements. People living in the UK but receiving payments in Euros or US Dollars have seen a nice increase in their rates, but many eurozone translators working for UK companies have either been asked to reduce their euro rates, or have seen the value of their sterling rates decline.

We have not reduced our rates or our prices - we believe that customers who place cost above quality are probably wasting the money they are spending.

Thank you again for your participation, we will write to everyone again in 6 months and see how the results compare.

Until then, we wish you a prosperous 2009. To quote one respondent to our survey, "Positive attitude - this is the secret! Panic is contagious, but so is a positive attitude".

Best wishes
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Laurent KRAULAND (X)
Laurent KRAULAND (X)  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 09:38
French to German
+ ...
About that French agency, Kevin... Feb 5, 2009

Kevin Lossner wrote:


I got a call the other day from some French agency wanting to "conduct a survey".

This agency (as there can be only one, which is clearly identified) also conducted an Internet survey by sending mass e-mails to translators living in France.

The results are a joke - what they officially want is to improve the image of the translation industry (yes, yes, Sir... freelancers AND agencies) towards end clients.

I noticed they didn't ask questions about rates as "this was already done through the annual survey of the SFT" - smart folks, but when you look on their website, you will find rates around 0.10 - 0.12 euros ex VAT for end clients...

Any comments needed?

Laurent K.


 
Aniello Scognamiglio (X)
Aniello Scognamiglio (X)  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 09:38
English to German
+ ...
It's better not to jump to conclusions... Feb 5, 2009

Amy Duncan wrote:

What has happened to your volume of work over the past 6 months?

* Gone up - 22%
* Stayed the same - 40%
* Gone down - 38%

What has happened to the rates you are able to charge over the past 6 months?

* Gone up - 12%
* Stayed the same - 72%
* Gone down - 16%


I fully agree: better not jump to conclusions...

- Volume of work has gone up - 22%: From what? 20 hours a week? 50 hours a week?
- Volume of work stayed the same - 40%: From 20 hours a week? Or 50?
- Volume of work has gone down - 38%: From 60 hours a week, or 40?
- Rates have gone up - 12%: From 20 cent/word or from 5 cent?
- Rates stayed the same - 72%: Which level? 10 cent/word, 15, 20...?
- Rates gone done - 16%: From 20 cent/word or 8?

What I want to say is, this survey is very vague and doesn't really say a lot.
It's not representative.

My 20 cents
Aniello


 
Taija Hyvönen
Taija Hyvönen
Finland
Local time: 10:38
Member (2008)
English to Finnish
+ ...
I can see the headlines Feb 5, 2009

Amy Duncan wrote:

What has happened to your volume of work over the past 6 months?

* Gone up - 22%
* Stayed the same - 40%
* Gone down - 38%

What has happened to the rates you are able to charge over the past 6 months?

* Gone up - 12%
* Stayed the same - 72%
* Gone down - 16%


Translators hard hit by recession: almost half are struggling to survive and for roughly every second of them rates have plummeted to the ground!

Freelance translation remains steady: volume of work the same for 40% and rates the same for over 70%

Translators emerge as winners in global crisis: a quarter is drowning in work and for every second of them, rates have skyrocketed!

Pick the one you like


 
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When honesty probably doesn't pay...







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