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Glossary entry

Portuguese term or phrase:

Mãe/Pai

English translation:

Ma / Pa

Added to glossary by Lara Barnett
Mar 19, 2024 04:58
11 mos ago
41 viewers *
Portuguese term

Mãe/Pai

Portuguese to English Other Names (personal, company)
The story is set in Canada in the 1880s. I've done SO much research already, but I still can't find a satisfactory answer. I'm not sure what kids would call their parents in this context -- it's a small village, mostly agricultural.

I thought about Ma/Pa, but I'm not sure if that would be realistic/appropriate or when/if they would switch to Mother/Father.

If anyone could help me with this, I'd be really grateful.
Proposed translations (English)
4 +5 Ma / Pa
4 +1 Mother/Father
Change log

Mar 19, 2024 14:24: philgoddard changed "Field" from "Art/Literary" to "Other"

Apr 2, 2024 07:48: Lara Barnett Created KOG entry

Discussion

Lara Barnett Mar 19, 2024:
@ Phil Although some people were quite probably very formal in past times, the links I have painstakingly spent time researching clearly reflect that not ALL characters would have been FORMAL speakers, and formality is often not a trait readily embraced by children/child characters.
Lara Barnett Mar 19, 2024:
@ Anna França (Asker) Please confirm the background/context of this text. Thank you.
Lara Barnett Mar 19, 2024:
@ Phil In works of literature the characters normally use familiar or register-appropriate language between each other. Would you directly call your parents mother and father? I know that I never have very often.
ronsmith Mar 19, 2024:
Maybe leave these words in Portuguese? <p>This is a hard one because, in English, when you see children calling their parents "Mother"/"Father", it sounds kind of creepy. Maybe it's because Normal in Hitchcock's Psychosis, maybe it's because it's just too formal, I don't know.</p>

<p>In Portuguese, on the other hand, even today it's common for children to call their parents Mãe/Pai. Calling they Mother/Father in 1880 would convey a XIX century formality that doesn't seem exist in the original Portuguese version.</p>

<p>I think that if this was being translated from Italian or Spanish, the translator wouldn't hesitate to use Mamma/Babbo or Mami/Papi. Maybe the best solution could be to let the reader realize that these children are Portuguese and they call their parents Mãe/Pai even when they are in Canada.</p>
Simone Taylor Mar 19, 2024:
Canada 1880s I am working on a book set in Surrey, which today is London's outskirts, in 1873. I came across once in my research, but I can't remember where, that Canada followed British customs, and it depended a lot on class. Mother and father were used in more formal situations, Mama and Papa in more informal situations, or even Ma and Pa. Upper-class children used in social situations, Ma'am and Sir or even Mater and Pater at boarding school. And you had the Home Children, exiled, who didn't even comprehend the concept of having a parent.

Proposed translations

+5
4 hrs
Selected

Ma / Pa

According to the references made in these Canadian works of literature, Ma and Pa was clearly used by some of the Canadian population at this period of time.

PA
"Charles Phillip Ingalls (January 10, 1836 – June 8, 1902) was an American pioneer, farmer, government official, musician, and carpenter who was the father of Laura Ingalls Wilder, known for her Little House series of books. He is depicted as the character "Pa" in the books and the television series."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Ingalls

MA
"I don’t know if I’m ready to share the March of Tears, but Ma and Pa are explaining to their girls that the Indians won’t be there long because the government will continue to move them off the land as white settlers pick their land. ..."
https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1085380.page

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs (2024-03-19 09:49:51 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

MA
"In this tale, Laura discovers that Ma can do anything. She can make butter from milk and hats from a bundle of straw, and..."
https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/439854

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs (2024-03-19 09:51:25 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

"Ma And Pa Ingalls Married This Week In 1860"
https://www.wpr.org/books/ma-and-pa-ingalls-married-week-186...
Peer comment(s):
agree Simone Taylor
38 mins
Thank you
agree Clauwolf
1 hr
Thank you.
neutral philgoddard : I don't see any reason to use the informal terms unless 'mother/father' sounds inappropriate for the relationship.//Maybe not now, but people were more formal then.
4 hrs
Most people do not directly address their parents as "MOTHER" & "FATHER" - The asker has stated: THE STORY is set in Canada in the 1880s, making clear this concerns hist. CHARACTERS./ 2nd post/ WHICH IS THE REASON I PAINSTAKINGLY RESEARCHED these links !
agree Matheus Chaud
1 day 14 hrs
Thank you
agree Yuri Toledo
5 days
Thank you
agree Aline Amorim
5 days
Thank you
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Selected automatically based on peer agreement."
+1
3 hrs

Mother/Father

Presumably then the people in your story are immigrants from Portugal?
If it helps, I can tell you that it is very common in Portugal for people to address most of their family members with the correct family-relationship term, in a way that sounds quite formal to the non-Portuguese ear. It seems relatively rare for people to address their own children by name. Instead you hear, for example, "Ô daughter, sit down and eat your lunch".

In particular, Father, Mother, Son, Daughter, Grandfather, Grandmother, etc., all these are constantly used to address family members. "Brother, sister" etc aren't heard often. I wouldn't substitute "Ma" or "Pa" or anything like that, I'd leave them formal.
Peer comment(s):
agree philgoddard : It doesn't say 'mamãe/papá/papai'.
5 hrs
Something went wrong...
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