Nov 8 15:21
8 days ago
32 viewers *
French term

désignation de fantaisie

French to English Law/Patents Law: Patents, Trademarks, Copyright
Il est possible que l'association de deux mots en eux-mêmes tirés du domaine public crée une désignation de fantaisie susceptible d'être protégée.
C'est une expression concernant une marque déposée; merci à l'avance de votre aide!

Discussion

Conor McAuley Nov 14:
Go pick a fight in an empty room mate...
Andrzej Ziomek Nov 14:
Conor McAuley What???
Who's picking up a fight? Who needs chilling out?
Have you read: 'Just posted a discussion entry (based on my findings), for the sake of discussion'?
Conor McAuley Nov 14:
So, you know, chill out.

This isn't X, there are standards here and they are upheld.
Conor McAuley Nov 14:
Andrzej Sakski posted a day or two before you, with good references.

But if you want to pick a fight with everyone here, good luck with that, if that's what makes
you happy.
I'll be delighted to set you right every time, as I'm sure the Mods will.

A few of us have been at this for over 20 years, we've seen people come and go.



Andrzej Ziomek Nov 14:
@Conor McAuley

Not to be misunderstood, I don't insist on my answer or question the 'agrees'. Just posted a discussion entry (based on my findings), for the sake of discussion.
By the way, Sakshi suggested 'fanciful' too.
Conor McAuley Nov 13:
Given the evidence presented here, by Bourth and Sakshi, I feel that Mpoma has been
fair and polite. As a neutral observer.

By all means contact the Mods if you feel differently.

See the Agrees as well.
Andrzej Ziomek Nov 13:
As a person ‘whose mother tongue is not even English’, I’ll point out that the words:
‘In cases like this it is perfectly possible that fanciful (poor) translations into English, due to the faux ami factor, lead to a term such as "fanciful designation" becoming widespread, even normalised, even by lawyers.’
might be a bit disrespectful, not only to me but to the lawyers (whose mother tongue is English).
Conor McAuley Nov 13:
Aye, Mpoma Sakshi and Bourth (A.......) are obviously in exactly the right area.

This question initially caught me off-guard, but I'm a bit rusty at this and using a smartphone to post.
Mpoma Nov 13:
It's always nice ... to have some supporting evidence. "fanciful designation" gets 815 ghits, "invented name" (the WIPO term) gets 359,000 ghits. That might not prove much, but for the fact that most "invented name" ghits clearly demonstrate that term's use in this context.

In cases like this it is perfectly possible that fanciful (poor) translations into English, due to the faux ami factor, lead to a term such as "fanciful designation" becoming widespread, even normalised, even by lawyers. Entropy of this kind is probably unstoppable, but perhaps people whose mother tongue is not even English shouldn't add to the confusion unnecessarily.
Andrzej Ziomek Nov 13:
https://www.casemine.com/commentary/us/protection-of-fancifu...

Complex Concepts Simplified
The judgment employs several legal concepts that are crucial to understanding trademark law:

Fanciful Designation: A trademark that is invented and has no prior meaning (e.g., "Xerox"). Such marks are inherently distinctive and strongly protectable.
Descriptive Term: A term [...]
Mpoma Nov 13:
Once again we're in faux ami territory here Fantaisie can be translated as "fancy", but it covers wider ground that that, and refers to "work of the imagination" or "inventive activity", i.e. the essence of what constitutes intellectual property, as far as bodies like WIPO are concerned. The English words "fancy" or "fanciful" are the wrong register for legalese. There is absolutely nothing light-hearted about this expression in the source text. Bourth has also found evidence that WIPO likes "invented name". Sounds about right.

Proposed translations

+5
1 hr
Selected

invented name

For future reference, I feel it is worth recording here that for pharmaceuticals, and in Europe at least, 'fanciful trademark' is not said. Instead they speak of 'invented name'.

Remarkably, the European Medicines Agency (EMA) does not speak about “Trademarks” but calls it “Invented Names”. It is a requirement of EMA that there is only a single Invented Name for a drug and this name should be used in all 27 Member States of the European Community.
https://www.koningstrademarks.nl/blog-eng/invented-names/?la...

To choose the strongest type of trademark, ideally you should come up with a brand name that is completely unique, evena fanciful or invented name that hasn’t been used before. Other distinctive types of trademark, not quite as strong as invented marks, include arbitrary or suggestive marks.
https://www.trademarksonline.com.au/blog/2020/8/23/what-is-a...


The name, which may be either an invented name not liable to confusion with the common name, or a common or scientific name accompanied by a trade mark or the name of the marketing authorisation holder

for the identification of the medicinal product: (i) the name of the medicinal product followed by its strength and pharmaceutical form, and, if appropriate, whether it is intended for babies, children or adults. The common name shall be included where the product contains only one active substance and if its name is an invented name;

the scientific name of the stock or stocks followed by the degree of dilution, making use of the symbols of the pharmacopoeia used in accordance with Article 1(5); if the homeopathic medicinal product is composed of two or more stocks, the scientific names of the stocks on the labelling may be supplemented by an invented name,
https://www.wipo.int/wipolex/en/legislation/details/13061

nom du médicament: le nom, qui peut être soit un nom de fantaisie, ne pouvant se confondre avec la dénomination commune, soit une dénomination commune ou scientifique assortie d'une marque ou du nom du titulaire de l'autorisation de mise sur le marché;

le nom du médicament suivie du dosage et de la forme pharmaceutique et, le cas échéant, de la mention du destinataire (nourrissons, enfants ou adultes); la dénomination commune doit figurer lorsque le médicament ne contient qu'une seule substance active et que sa dénomination est un nom de fantaisie;

dénomination scientifique de la ou des souches suivie du degré de dilution en employant les symboles de la pharmacopée utilisée conformément à l'article 1er, point 5); si le médicament homéopathique est composé de plusieurs souches, la dénomination scientifique des souches dans l'étiquetage peut être complétée par un nom de fantaisie,
https://www.wipo.int/wipolex/en/legislation/details/13061

Change in the (invented) name of the medicinal product
Copy of the EMEA letter of acceptance of the new the (invented) name.
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:C:...

Changement dans la dénomination (de fantaisie) du médicament
Copie de la lettre de l’EMEA portant acceptation de la nouvelle dénomination (de fantaisie).
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:C:...


Peer comment(s):

agree Daryo : When it comes to trademarks, I would take whatever comes from WIPO as "THE reference". // Personally I would call it a "purpose-coined name" by analogy with a "purpose-build house", but there is no point in arguing against established trade jargon.
14 hrs
agree Charlotte Allen : Yes, this, I think, or 'fanciful name' or 'coined name'. All of these terms seem to get used a bit interchangeably
2 days 21 mins
agree Conor McAuley
2 days 16 hrs
agree Mpoma : Yes, WIPO is the reference
5 days
agree AllegroTrans : WIPO for sure
7 days
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Merci Bourth et merci à tous"
+2
10 mins

Fanciful trademark

Fanciful Trademark: A Comprehensive Explanation >
A fanciful trademark is the strongest trademark type and, in addition to providing examples below, we define it as one that is “coined” for the purpose of serving as a trademark. Of the four types of trademarks, fanciful trademarks receive the most protection from trademark infringement since:... >
https://syedlawoffices.com/blog/fanciful-trademark-a-compreh...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 10 mins (2024-11-08 15:31:52 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Fanciful trademarks are newly coined marks that have no meaning in any language and do not describe the goods/or services applied for. In essence, fanciful trademarks are created to function solely as a trademark. Because fanciful trademarks are not descriptive or generic, they are afforded stronger trademark protection and are typically easier to get allowed... >
https://smithhopen.com/glossary/fanciful-trademark/
Peer comment(s):

agree Bourth
1 hr
Thank you, Bourth!
agree Charlotte Allen : I think 'fanciful name' or 'coined name' but I'm not sure 'trademark' is accurate for désignation
2 days 1 hr
Thank you, Charlotte!
agree Conor McAuley : Excellent, yes Sakshi!
2 days 17 hrs
Thank you, Conor!
disagree Mpoma : No, this is quite a specific term in intellectual property. A little searching will show that all references are Swiss or Luxembourg French. And also show what WIPO uses.
5 days
neutral AllegroTrans : Fanciful answer
7 days
Something went wrong...
4 hrs

fancy label

Fancy that! Neither quite regd. as a TM, nor a fancy designation of a wine.

I thought 'fancy' was an IP = intellectual property *textbook* tem of art.

> articles de fantaisie = fancy goods, Navarre.
Example sentence:

Fancy designations. For wine types, see special wines and for wine law issues, see wine labelling law.

These crispy snacks are lightly salted and/or spiced, and packaged to the client's specification, AW brand, fancy label or private labels.

Peer comment(s):

neutral AllegroTrans : Fanciful answer
6 days
Something went wrong...
-1
15 hrs

fanciful designation

ma proposition

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 days (2024-11-13 18:34:41 GMT)
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https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/trademark

The second requirement, that a mark be distinctive, addresses a trademark's capacity for identifying and distinguishing particular goods as emanating from one producer or source and not another. Trademarks are traditionally divided into four categories of distinctiveness:

Arbitrary/fanciful
Suggestive
Descriptive
Generic

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 days (2024-11-13 18:51:28 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

https://caselaw.findlaw.com/court/ia-supreme-court/1261691.h...

'A fanciful designation is a term having no meaning other than identifying the source.   See Restatement § 13 cmt. c. An example of a fanciful designation is the word EXXON. [...]'



--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 days (2024-11-13 20:46:02 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

https://casetext.com/case/comm-savings-bk-v-hawkeye-fed-sav-...

Example sentence:

'The company name may contain the name of an individual, describe the actual activities of the company, or be a fanciful designation. [...]'

'It is a fanciful designation and, to the best of the Complainant's knowledge, it does not constitute an existing word in the dictionaries. [...]'

Peer comment(s):

agree SafeTex : or "fanciful name"
15 hrs
Thank you.
disagree Mpoma : See discussion: the evidence, such as it is, is against this being a widely accepted term. I think it's probably the consequence of guesswork. NB note that the WIPO "evidence" here clearly concerns a French complainant.
4 days
disagree AllegroTrans : Fanciful answer
6 days
Something went wrong...
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