| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Could the Blue Board facility be improved? Thread poster: Richard Jenkins
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Richard Jenkins 
Brazil
Local time: 05:59
Member (2006)
Portuguese to English
+ ...
Hi,
Today I was offered a small job by an agency with an impeccable Blue Board record. Most of the posted comments were virtually identical: "Excellent agency, almost INSTANT payment".
What surprised me however was the very low rates, so I naturally didn't accept the job.
Logically, and this is my point; I didn't make a negative entry about the customer even though I wanted to. I wanted to give a low rating but I didn't feel it was right because I hadn't ac... See more Hi,
Today I was offered a small job by an agency with an impeccable Blue Board record. Most of the posted comments were virtually identical: "Excellent agency, almost INSTANT payment".
What surprised me however was the very low rates, so I naturally didn't accept the job.
Logically, and this is my point; I didn't make a negative entry about the customer even though I wanted to. I wanted to give a low rating but I didn't feel it was right because I hadn't actually done any work for them.
Is the Blue Board ranking a good indication of how good a company is? ▲ Collapse
| | | | Claudio Porcellana (X)
Italy
| Blueboard flaws, possibly... | Mar 20, 2010 |
Hi
it would be a good indication if peers would use a slower and more pondered score method
for example, don't putting a 5 immediately after the first job, just trying to get on the right side of the agency, but rather waiting some month at least, to deeply assess it in every way
clearly, a deeper score system would be fine
for example, the option to score separately every facet of an agency:
rates, fairness, collaboration, payment speed and s... See more Hi
it would be a good indication if peers would use a slower and more pondered score method
for example, don't putting a 5 immediately after the first job, just trying to get on the right side of the agency, but rather waiting some month at least, to deeply assess it in every way
clearly, a deeper score system would be fine
for example, the option to score separately every facet of an agency:
rates, fairness, collaboration, payment speed and so on
last but not least, it is rumoured that some LP forces translators to remove low scores in exchange for the payment, and clearly, if such behavior were true, it would be another confounding factor
Claudio ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Negative entries are discouraged even | Mar 20, 2010 |
I feel that mostly, posting negative entries in blueboards are discouraged for the reason of 'creation of negativity or negative environment' or so-called 'quality blames', which are creation of the organizations or companies to save themselves from negative entries. These are one of the reason, perhaps, for most helpless translators, that they are unable to post negative entries, whereas, positive entries are welcomed. False quality blame is another weapon of inefficient companies or agencies t... See more I feel that mostly, posting negative entries in blueboards are discouraged for the reason of 'creation of negativity or negative environment' or so-called 'quality blames', which are creation of the organizations or companies to save themselves from negative entries. These are one of the reason, perhaps, for most helpless translators, that they are unable to post negative entries, whereas, positive entries are welcomed. False quality blame is another weapon of inefficient companies or agencies to save oneself from negative entries perhaps. I feel that translator friends should be given equal chances to have their word spoken in such cases.
Please don't take this post as an attempt to 'creation of negativity', I simply tried to mention another possible reason of Blueboard flaws.
Happy Translating!
[Edited at 2010-03-20 02:38 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Yolanda Broad
United States
Local time: 03:59
Member (2000)
French to English
+ ...
MODERATOR | Blue Board entries are for Likelihood of Working Again | Mar 20, 2010 |
LWAs (Likelihood of Working Again) are entered at the discretion of the person who has performed work for an outsourcer. While it is no doubt true that certain outsourcers encourage their (satisfied) service providers (translators) to enter LWAs in their Blue Board record, it has also proven to be the case that when a situation deteriorates between an outsourcer and its service providers, the Blue Board will clearly reflect the situation. And multiple low entries in the Blue Board will often, ... See more LWAs (Likelihood of Working Again) are entered at the discretion of the person who has performed work for an outsourcer. While it is no doubt true that certain outsourcers encourage their (satisfied) service providers (translators) to enter LWAs in their Blue Board record, it has also proven to be the case that when a situation deteriorates between an outsourcer and its service providers, the Blue Board will clearly reflect the situation. And multiple low entries in the Blue Board will often, indeed, influence the outsourcer to remedy the situation.
High and low LWAs are entered for many reasons: if you peruse the Blue Board, you will find low LWAs that report fast payment of good rates, but a poor relationship with the outsourcer, and, on the other hand, high and moderately high LWAs that report low rates, but an especially pleasant working relationship. People have a multitude of reasons for wanting or not wanting to continue a relationship.
Here is the rule about who may enter an LWA:
Certain conditions must be met before Blue Board entries can be made. Entries concerning willingness to work again with given outsourcers are allowed only when (1) commissioned work has been completed in full and delivered on time, and (2) there have not been complaints related to quality shortly after delivery. Entries may not be made on the basis of negotiations, test translations, or other preliminary or non-commissioned interactions.
http://www.proz.com/siterules/blue_board_bb_blueboard/2#2
For more information about how the Blue Board works, and what its purpose is, please see:
http://www.proz.com/faq/blue_board_outsourcer_database_.html ▲ Collapse
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Richard Jenkins
Brazil
Local time: 05:59
Member (2006)
Portuguese to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Constructive criticism, not an attack | Mar 20, 2010 |
Yolanda Broad wrote:
(1) commissioned work has been completed in full and delivered on time...
I'm aware of the rules and that is exactly my point and the reason why I didn't make an entry - I have never worked for this agency and I am not planning on doing so because of their current rates, but I still believe that I should be able to tell others about my feelings and explain why I don't think the company is truly 'five' star. I might give them a '4', but not a five. It's not fair because I wasted time today negotiating with a company that I would have preferred to let pass by.
This is not an attack on Proz. The Blue Board system is not perfect and I feel it can be improved on.
| | | | Laurent KRAULAND (X)
France
Local time: 09:59
French to German
+ ...
| Use of the BB | Mar 20, 2010 |
Claudio Porcellana wrote:
Hi
it would be a good indication if peers would use a slower and more pondered score method
for example, don't putting a 5 immediately after the first job, just trying to get on the right side of the agency, but rather waiting some month at least, to deeply assess it in every way
Hi all,
I have to agree completely with Claudio here.
Remember that we have only the right to make one entry per year and per outsourcer. This in itself should make us think about the way we give ratings.
Furthermore, and for the sake of fairness, I fail to see why we should hurry to post a good LWA rating when most agencies simply do not think of giving a WWA rating.
I do not mean that it must be a LWA against WWA deal, which would contradict the objectives of both rating systems, but we need to think about the current imbalance...
| | | | | Entries after a first job... no good | Mar 20, 2010 |
Richard Jenkins wrote:
Logically, and this is my point; I didn't make a negative entry about the customer even though I wanted to. I wanted to give a low rating but I didn't feel it was right because I hadn't actually done any work for them.
The Blueboard is a measure of a customer's reliability in terms of negotiation, specifications, communication, responsiveness, and of course payment, but by no means should it be a measure of good rates or subjective considerations.
I generally feel the Blueboard is being misused by a number of colleagues who add a very good comment after just one job, whereas comments should be added after a number of jobs and a minimum of a year of cooperation, in my opinion.
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 09:59
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
We pay your slave rates on time = we are a good agency
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Heinrich Pesch
Finland
Local time: 10:59
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
| Only 5's or 1's | Mar 20, 2010 |
IMO it does not make sense to give notes in between. Either I am ready to work with the agency again or not. In my experience an agency who did not pay for a year suddenly remembers me when I give her a 1 on the BB, just to get it off the record.
But is has nothing to do with rates. Slave rates for us may make a good income for someone else.
Regards
Heinrich
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Lingua 5B wrote:
We pay your slave rates on time = we are a good agency
Yes, if an outsourcer pays on time, provides quick responses to your queries etc., they can be considered a good one. I'm not advocating low rates here but I cannot understand unreasonable blames like this one.
IMHO, low rates should not be a reason to post negative comments. I think it is unfair if you accept a job at whatever low rates an outsourcer may offer and then you post a negative entry saying, among other things, the outsourcer pays low. I see this happens quite often on the BB.
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 09:59
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
| There's more beyond it | Mar 20, 2010 |
Andrei Yefimov wrote:
I think it is unfair if you accept a job at whatever low rates an outsourcer may offer and then you post a negative entry saying, among other things, the outsourcer pays low.
That may be because they accept one rate, and then during the project realization, they see it's much more work than it's paid for ( bulky formats, poorly written text - yes, you can skim the text upfront but not really read it in detail, and many other unexpected features you can't predict or see upfront, but the agency could if they really cared ( it's their material, not yours))
Edited to add just one example:
An agency contacts you asking you for your rate; they tell you about the project and the subject matter ( they keep silent about the format). You give them your rate, they accept it. After this they send you a string of terms and passages in a tabular form ( this format should cost 50% higher because of its inconvenience while working - no surrounding text, context etc). That's just one example, but there are thousands.
See, if agencies weren't so sneaky and were more honest, discontent on the translators' part could be avoided.
[Edited at 2010-03-20 10:51 GMT]
| | | | | agree but... | Mar 20, 2010 |
That may be because they accept one rate, and then during the project realization, they see it's much more work than it's paid for ( bulky formats, poorly written text - yes, you can skim the text upfront but not really read it in detail, and many other unexpected features you can't predict or see upfront, but the agency could if they really cared ( it's their material, not yours))
Yes, I agree. But why not clearly state this then? The comments I am talking about usually go like this:
"Poor communication. Unclear instructions. Also, they pay low rates."
Edited to add just one example:
An agency contacts you asking you for your rate; they tell you about the project and the subject matter ( they keep silent about the format). You give them your rate, they accept it. After this they send you a string of terms and passages in a tabular form ( this format should cost 50% higher because of its inconvenience while working - no surrounding text, context etc). That's just one example, but there are thousands.
See, if agencies weren't so sneaky and were more honest, discontent on the translators' part could be avoided.
I agree again. But why not turn it down immediately? Yes, they may keep silent, but once you see the reality, it is up to you to decide.
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Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 09:59
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
| I've just explained it/ reread it | Mar 20, 2010 |
Sometimes, you can't see the "reality" as you call it, until you have dug deaper into the project ( while working on it).. you may realize they have inserted a large portion of poor nonnative English somewhere in the middle of a 40,000 word file? What then?
Needless to say, decoding nonnative English is annoying, takes a lot time, and thus should cost more. Say you had agreed on the price upfront and the agency won't accept any price changes now.
[Edited at 2010-03-20 11:25 G... See more Sometimes, you can't see the "reality" as you call it, until you have dug deaper into the project ( while working on it).. you may realize they have inserted a large portion of poor nonnative English somewhere in the middle of a 40,000 word file? What then?
Needless to say, decoding nonnative English is annoying, takes a lot time, and thus should cost more. Say you had agreed on the price upfront and the agency won't accept any price changes now.
[Edited at 2010-03-20 11:25 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | this is clarified but | Mar 20, 2010 |
I see what you mean and I agree, but how about the type of comments I have described? I still think it is unfair, and there is nothing beyond it other than what was initially posted, or else it would have been clearly stated.
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 09:59
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
| Summarized comments | Mar 20, 2010 |
Andrei Yefimov wrote:
I see what you mean and I agree, but how about the type of comments I have described? I still think it is unfair, and there is nothing beyond it other than what was initially posted, or else it would have been clearly stated.
BB space doesn't allow posters to state all details. You need to summarize it. But you can always add " I can provide details via email"
[Edited at 2010-03-20 11:27 GMT]
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